Tweet
a conversation im having with a friend of mine.
idk. something to think about.
something to throw your two cents at.
this is the song that started it.
her: The emotive, it's all about capturing and envoking that emotive.
I think that's why I still (yeah still) haven't fully gotten on that Wayne tip as yet.
Yeah, I said it.
Where's the emotion mayneee?!?
Are we saying that niggas can't cry?
me : niggas can cry. they just cant mope.
niggas can reflect all day.
her : So what's different about this reflection and Cole's reflection? Haha.
me : cole feels sorry himself and its boring.
niggas got feelings and emotions for days.
niggas aint have fathers either.
her : I've heard Something You Forgot. But I don't connect. I don't why. I don't feel anything when I hear this.
Let me try again.
(o.O)
me : since ive lost you.
im lost too. nigga feeling.
like he at the bottom like a horse shoe.
sorry for the trouble that i put you and your heart through.
god knows that ill do anything for a part two.
ought to be praying for the day you come back to me saying.
that you forgive me. give me another chance.
im needing it like a kidney. i dont wanna advance.
give me back her hands. give me back her touch.
i dont ask for much.<<<< the difference.
j cole is on some pity shit while his pencil gently weeps.
but wayne is stronger than that. he this resolve about himself.
so you dont really get these weak emotions.
and when you do get something thats sensitive.
theres a sincerity. but theres also strength.
and hes addressing his shit. he doesnt wallow in his misery.
her: But I don't see the pity though, I see the pain.
Constructions of strength and overcoming is so played for me. Bottling up or putting of facades, that's what I see.
Where's the anguish, the sadness, the struggle, the tears, the pain?
So many (black) (male - but female too) rappers don't ever want to show pain and sadness, yet it exists.
The facades, they are saturated in rap, you can't deny that.
me : lol. im iffy on the constructions of strenght.
idk what that means. its takes an outside influence to be strong?
but its natural to be in anguish and knee deep in sadness?
idk if that adds up.
and in waynes case. its intrinsic.
you just have to get familiar with it.
thats when you can understand all that hes gone through.
its like reading every book an author has written.
you start to feel like you know the author.
otherwise. those are private intense emotions.
they dont have to be showcased and exploited for the sake.
of getting someone to relate to the material.
her : When I talk about constructions of strength, I'm talking about the ways in which strength has become gendered and racialised. So for example, Black women tend to embody this so called "strength", but when you go out into other racial spaces, that strength doesn't necessarily exist or manifest in the same ways.
So similarly, when I talk about Wayne and other (black) rappers (rappers who might have grown up in inner city areas, projects, etc.) there's this hypermasculine construction of oneself (that tends to come out through their rap) that embodies this strength.
So like concepts such as men don't cry, men don't feel, men are expected to be strong, men are not emotional beings and how that further transcends to the racialised male being, so the particular minority men don't feel, cry, etc. In the case of Wayne and others like him, it's the black man is void of emotion. So a rapper who isn't void of emotion is seen as different or weird or not deserving of respect or whack - am I making sense?
me : it makes sense.
but it isnt the case with wayne.
his entire body of work is built on emotion.
but its found in his expression and in the context.
moreso than whats being written down.
i think thats what makes it profound.
theres a genuine depth to his work.
and theres a sincerity. because it is a man.
who is strong. but that doesnt stop him from feeling.
that doesnt stop him from being emotional. i think its a mistake.
to put those on opposite ends of the spectrum. but what we have with cole. is almost surface level. or even rudimentary. i was sad cos my pops is gone. well? what of it? is that all. whats to become of you.
while youre holding all that resentment. you could be off.
doing some g shit. loool. no but really. i think its the approach.
you can feel pain all day. and do nothing but think about it.
or you could use it to stiffen up your backbone.
and there really isnt too much backbone in jcoles rap.
or not any that i care to believe. but its not his fault.
(it kind of is) because he hasnt really gone through much.
but i do think theres plenty rappers like that.
but idk. i just dont feel them like that.
you can just tell when the emotions are lacking.
it doesnt feel authentic. cole has the emotions.
he just hasnt shaped them into anything meaningful.
besides some sob stories. lol. and its okay to cry. sure.
but then what?
i think this is why ive always felt j cole was immature.
i swear ive heard him make the same songs for three years now.
he needs some growth.
its deeper than rap.
this is ongoing.
i dont think anyone is going to read this.
but idk. its a good conversation on what i think.
makes wayne pretty special. so idk. maybe its interesting.
idk. something to think about.
something to throw your two cents at.
this is the song that started it.
her: The emotive, it's all about capturing and envoking that emotive.
I think that's why I still (yeah still) haven't fully gotten on that Wayne tip as yet.
Yeah, I said it.
Where's the emotion mayneee?!?
Are we saying that niggas can't cry?
me : niggas can cry. they just cant mope.
niggas can reflect all day.
her : So what's different about this reflection and Cole's reflection? Haha.
me : cole feels sorry himself and its boring.
niggas got feelings and emotions for days.
niggas aint have fathers either.
her : I've heard Something You Forgot. But I don't connect. I don't why. I don't feel anything when I hear this.
Let me try again.
(o.O)
me : since ive lost you.
im lost too. nigga feeling.
like he at the bottom like a horse shoe.
sorry for the trouble that i put you and your heart through.
god knows that ill do anything for a part two.
ought to be praying for the day you come back to me saying.
that you forgive me. give me another chance.
im needing it like a kidney. i dont wanna advance.
give me back her hands. give me back her touch.
i dont ask for much.<<<< the difference.
j cole is on some pity shit while his pencil gently weeps.
but wayne is stronger than that. he this resolve about himself.
so you dont really get these weak emotions.
and when you do get something thats sensitive.
theres a sincerity. but theres also strength.
and hes addressing his shit. he doesnt wallow in his misery.
her: But I don't see the pity though, I see the pain.
Constructions of strength and overcoming is so played for me. Bottling up or putting of facades, that's what I see.
Where's the anguish, the sadness, the struggle, the tears, the pain?
So many (black) (male - but female too) rappers don't ever want to show pain and sadness, yet it exists.
The facades, they are saturated in rap, you can't deny that.
me : lol. im iffy on the constructions of strenght.
idk what that means. its takes an outside influence to be strong?
but its natural to be in anguish and knee deep in sadness?
idk if that adds up.
and in waynes case. its intrinsic.
you just have to get familiar with it.
thats when you can understand all that hes gone through.
its like reading every book an author has written.
you start to feel like you know the author.
otherwise. those are private intense emotions.
they dont have to be showcased and exploited for the sake.
of getting someone to relate to the material.
her : When I talk about constructions of strength, I'm talking about the ways in which strength has become gendered and racialised. So for example, Black women tend to embody this so called "strength", but when you go out into other racial spaces, that strength doesn't necessarily exist or manifest in the same ways.
So similarly, when I talk about Wayne and other (black) rappers (rappers who might have grown up in inner city areas, projects, etc.) there's this hypermasculine construction of oneself (that tends to come out through their rap) that embodies this strength.
So like concepts such as men don't cry, men don't feel, men are expected to be strong, men are not emotional beings and how that further transcends to the racialised male being, so the particular minority men don't feel, cry, etc. In the case of Wayne and others like him, it's the black man is void of emotion. So a rapper who isn't void of emotion is seen as different or weird or not deserving of respect or whack - am I making sense?
me : it makes sense.
but it isnt the case with wayne.
his entire body of work is built on emotion.
but its found in his expression and in the context.
moreso than whats being written down.
i think thats what makes it profound.
theres a genuine depth to his work.
and theres a sincerity. because it is a man.
who is strong. but that doesnt stop him from feeling.
that doesnt stop him from being emotional. i think its a mistake.
to put those on opposite ends of the spectrum. but what we have with cole. is almost surface level. or even rudimentary. i was sad cos my pops is gone. well? what of it? is that all. whats to become of you.
while youre holding all that resentment. you could be off.
doing some g shit. loool. no but really. i think its the approach.
you can feel pain all day. and do nothing but think about it.
or you could use it to stiffen up your backbone.
and there really isnt too much backbone in jcoles rap.
or not any that i care to believe. but its not his fault.
(it kind of is) because he hasnt really gone through much.
but i do think theres plenty rappers like that.
but idk. i just dont feel them like that.
you can just tell when the emotions are lacking.
it doesnt feel authentic. cole has the emotions.
he just hasnt shaped them into anything meaningful.
besides some sob stories. lol. and its okay to cry. sure.
but then what?
i think this is why ive always felt j cole was immature.
i swear ive heard him make the same songs for three years now.
he needs some growth.
its deeper than rap.
this is ongoing.
i dont think anyone is going to read this.
but idk. its a good conversation on what i think.
makes wayne pretty special. so idk. maybe its interesting.
Comment