Make an Argument for why Wayne is one of the best in the Game

[jhoya101]

if wayne didnt put out so much music i guarentee there would be no one who didnt think he was the GOAT. its because he puts so much music which gives people more chance to not feel every song so they think he is hit or miss. but if he died in his prime like pac or didnt put out as much songs/features like kendrick and jayz then every single person would call him the goat

This

[when_it_snow_im_on_top]

None of these new rappers have influenced a whole new generation yet, won 5 Grammys, put out 50 features in a year, gone Platinum in a week, etc.....

grammys dont matter js

- - - Updated - - -

if wayne didnt put out so much music i guarentee there would be no one who didnt think he was the GOAT. its because he puts so much music which gives people more chance to not feel every song so they think he is hit or miss. but if he died in his prime like pac or didnt put out as much songs/features like kendrick and jayz then every single person would call him the goat

This. Wayne oversaturated and tried experimented which is good for fans but could hurt image

[danielnfl36]

Funeral > mtbmb is genral consensus same with C5 > kamikaze (But I get your point but throwing in eminem was a bit much)

But even with Funeral I think you could argue hes a top 10 best rapper in 2020

I think C6 will make or break waynes commercial career going forward

I threw Em in because no matter where they are in their careers they always will be neck and neck in terms of what they were career wise between their primes. Wayne brought that on himself a bit with saying things like he was afraid to do a song and whatnot with him.

I don't like Em myself but I admit he is doing better things in 2020 and recent memory.

Funeral felt like some attempt to be what everyone is doing right now, and it didn't work for me.

And C6 I expect to be better than C5 because for me only 5 songs really are good to me. (Unpopular opinion, I know)

I think being older and a very established artist it's harder for Wayne to become a big seller again. The best days are behind him.
Think of it like an athlete with a ACL or Achilles injury. The burst and and jumping ability goes. Either they sink or swim.

Kobe being a great example to use here. Before the major leg injuries Kobe could dunk and do all sorts of crazy things, after he became a more polished player in terms of passing, shooting and more technique sound. Wayne matches that with being a better song creator, more polished song writing / lyrics however lacks the burst and ability to tap into the voice and confidence he had before he became "injured"

Between 2007-2011 the most average lines sounded incredible with the confidence and voice.

2014-2016 was Wayne being hungry but without that confidence he previously had.

2017-202? Wayne talks about being a goat, but the drive to actively be the goat isn't there because he's chasing everyone's sound and not creating sounds. Wayne has always had cool lyrics and crazy punchlines, but vocal wise, beat wise, sound wise and rhyme scheme wise, he's chasing everything everyone else is doing instead of leading and trying to split himself from the rest.

- - - Updated - - -

if wayne didnt put out so much music i guarentee there would be no one who didnt think he was the GOAT. its because he puts so much music which gives people more chance to not feel every song so they think he is hit or miss. but if he died in his prime like pac or didnt put out as much songs/features like kendrick and jayz then every single person would call him the goat

This argument unfortunately doesn't work in 2020 - A lot of artists are actively spamming the world with music and getting more collective listens and plays on their newer content. as for the going platinum in a week thing, it's basically impossible with how streaming has taken over and physical cd / vinyl sales being seen as a joke to most people. it's 10 streams per 1 single sale (PER SONG) Wayne was in the era where streaming hadn't taken off really at the time, also physical sales were pretty strong. I get your point bro, but it's harder to go platinum now than it was back in the day. Wayne outside of Carter albums hasn't done it lol.

[back on my bullish*t]

if wayne didnt put out so much music i guarentee there would be no one who didnt think he was the GOAT. its because he puts so much music which gives people more chance to not feel every song so they think he is hit or miss. but if he died in his prime like pac or didnt put out as much songs/features like kendrick and jayz then every single person would call him the goat

exactly this
how weezy can put out something like fwa and then put out funeral is crazy

[when_it_snow_im_on_top]

1) I threw Em in because no matter where they are in their careers they always will be neck and neck in terms of what they were career wise between their primes. Wayne brought that on himself a bit with saying things like he was afraid to do a song and whatnot with him.

2) I don't like Em myself but I admit he is doing better things in 2020 and recent memory.

Funeral felt like some attempt to be what everyone is doing right now, and it didn't work for me.

3) And C6 I expect to be better than C5 because for me only 5 songs really are good to me. (Unpopular opinion, I know)

I think being older and a very established artist it's harder for Wayne to become a big seller again.


4) 2017-202? Wayne talks about being a goat, but the drive to actively be the goat isn't there because he's chasing everyone's sound and not creating sounds. Wayne has always had cool lyrics and crazy punchlines, but vocal wise, beat wise, sound wise and rhyme scheme wise, he's chasing everything everyone else is doing instead of leading and trying to split himself from the rest.

5) This argument unfortunately doesn't work in 2020 - A lot of artists are actively spamming the world with music and getting more collective listens and plays on their newer content. as for the going platinum in a week thing, it's basically impossible with how streaming has taken over and physical cd / vinyl sales being seen as a joke to most people.

6) it's 10 streams per 1 single sale (PER SONG) Wayne was in the era where streaming hadn't taken off really at the time, also physical sales were pretty strong.

7) I get your point bro, but it's harder to go platinum now than it was back in the day.

Wayne outside of Carter albums hasn't done it lol.

1) Em's peak commercial success is way bigger than Waynes so it makes sense hes outsellin him (however gap shouldnt be that big)

2) General consensus was Funeral > MTBMB

3) C5 was great I honestly dont know if C6 will top it (kinda worried tbh) He wont be a huge seller even C5 wasn't "huge" but he should be able to get gold and maybe platinum in a year

4) C5 he definitely was not "chasing anyone else or copying sounds" Funeral was a more modern/trap album so yea hes gonna have modern/trap sounding beats

5) Platinum in a week is definitely possible now but throughout history only like 5 rap albums have ever done that.... so it wasnt something common.

6) 150 streams is a song sale and 1500 is an album sale (for RIAA) bilboard is slightly different.

7) Its not really harder now to go platinum tbh. Its harder to go multi platinum for sure. (Only way to rlly go 3x platinum or higher is to have rlly huge hits. Scorpion Astroworld and Invasion are only rap album from 2018+ to be 3x plat or higher and they all have a song diamond or almost diamond

This is why wayne needs to update his plaques so people stop thinking this lmao: Rebirth, IANAHB, IANAHB2 are all eligble for platinum

[Zimmie]

Plain and simple wayne does not know quality control its been an issue for years he replaced Playing with fire with pussy monster on his most popular album etc wayns quality control sucks so his albums age more quickly as a result kanye was a perfectionist

[Tha Mobb]

if wayne didnt put out so much music i guarentee there would be no one who didnt think he was the GOAT. its because he puts so much music which gives people more chance to not feel every song so they think he is hit or miss. but if he died in his prime like pac or didnt put out as much songs/features like kendrick and jayz then every single person would call him the goat

Yo this facts though

- - - Updated - - -

Plain and simple wayne does not know quality control its been an issue for years he replaced Playing with fire with pussy monster on his most popular album etc wayns quality control sucks so his albums age more quickly as a result kanye was a perfectionist

Agreed

[TrukDaWurl77]

In fairness, being the best at something is a what have you done for me lately thing.

I couldn't make an argument in terms of official releases that Wayne is the best rapper alive right now. I think his history makes him the best ever. but right now he's probably not even a top 10 rapper in terms of the actual content being released.

I know people aren't going to agree 100% with me but Cole, Kendrick, Drake, Em and lots of other people are release better music at this point in time.

A big part in it is his beat selection and methods of autotune he uses today, if he used the old autotune style I think people would be more excited.

Wayne at times goes on autopilot and half asses things. We seen a big major pickup in effort when he wasn't nominated for anything.


We need more Dedication 5 effort, not NC2 effort. We want Carter 4 energy and swagger back, not the "Hey, I'm still one of the best.. don't forget about me" efforts we seen on C5.

literally couldnt have said this any better.

[danielnfl36]

literally couldnt have said this any better.

Responding here instead of the other post, I often do agree with you and it is crazy man lol. But hey some people just want to settle when we know what the guy is able to do. It's not like he forgets being majorly famous even if the old songs don't get played, he still knows or has to know why he got to be on top. You don't just forget doing 100s of features between 06-2011. Wayne more than anyone has so much material out there for rediscovering such a special sound. If there was an album or two maybe the excuse that "it's hard to capture that with such limited inspiration to go off of" would work. But having literally 100s, nearly 1000s of songs from his without question prime, he can def study and figure out what made him the guy people think of when they say "GOAT"

[TrukDaWurl77]

Responding here instead of the other post, I often do agree with you and it is crazy man lol. But hey some people just want to settle when we know what the guy is able to do. It's not like he forgets being majorly famous even if the old songs don't get played, he still knows or has to know why he got to be on top. You don't just forget doing 100s of features between 06-2011. Wayne more than anyone has so much material out there for rediscovering such a special sound. If there was an album or two maybe the excuse that "it's hard to capture that with such limited inspiration to go off of" would work. But having literally 100s, nearly 1000s of songs from his without question prime, he can def study and figure out what made him the guy people think of when they say "GOAT"

all good dude! & so true man i am such an avid 04-2015 wayne fan (07-10 especially) that it's really hard for me to listen to his current shit & be like 'wow this is so good' when in reality it's just not. i agree with you 100% tho dude. it's like he never sits down and just goes through his old shit & he's literally said many times "once the album is done i forget about it & move onto the next" which is just ridiculous to me lmao. it's like holy shit if i ever found something with success like C3 id be like okay well let me try and continue that & evolve that style & see what i can do with it. instead it's like he just looked at all the current rappers & went.. "hey i can do that too" and now we have the wayne we see today. when i listen to c5/d6/d6r/funeral.. i literally just hear the same song. over. and over. and over. nothing stands out. nothing's unique. it's just him rapping a mile a minute almost every song with the highest pitch voice possible & the cheapest sounding autotune imaginable. i know he's better than that. i just don't know where his head has been at the last 5 years. telling you dude ever since the lawsuit he has not been the same.

[when_it_snow_im_on_top]

all good dude! & so true man i am such an avid 04-2015 wayne fan (07-10 especially) that it's really hard for me to listen to his current shit & be like 'wow this is so good' when in reality it's just not. i agree with you 100% tho dude. it's like he never sits down and just goes through his old shit & he's literally said many times "once the album is done i forget about it & move onto the next" which is just ridiculous to me lmao. it's like holy shit if i ever found something with success like C3 id be like okay well let me try and continue that & evolve that style & see what i can do with it. instead it's like he just looked at all the current rappers & went.. "hey i can do that too" and now we have the wayne we see today. when i listen to c5/d6/d6r/funeral.. i literally just hear the same song. over. and over. and over. nothing stands out. nothing's unique. it's just him rapping a mile a minute almost every song with the highest pitch voice possible & the cheapest sounding autotune imaginable. i know he's better than that. i just don't know where his head has been at the last 5 years. telling you dude ever since the lawsuit he has not been the same.

You are fucking deaf. You clearly did not listen to D6/6R and C5

[danielnfl36]

You are fucking deaf. You clearly did not listen to D6/6R and C5

I liked his take on Bank Account otherwise D6 / D6R are tapes he could keep, it's sad because D5 was so damn amazing. People hate on D4 but I love it personally. D3 is of course pretty experimental and Wayne at the start of his peak. D2 is often called a classic, but not my cup of tea personally. D1 isn't really my thing either. that's not calling them bad though.